Your Attitude Determines Your Direction
After a brief hiatus to focus on a few other endeavors, we're back with the latest installment of our Lieutenants Series, featuring the leaders who might not have the CEO title yet but who guide the ship, have scaled businesses, and get shit done. This Q&A features Hiral Chandrana, a unique leader and a major player in my story. Hiral was the mastermind behind Wipro's acquisition of Appirio, and I worked directly with Hiral for a number of years as one of his lieutenants.
Hiral spent more than 14 years at one of the largest IT services firms on the planet where he led a $3B portfolio but wasn’t afraid to write himself into an active role on a customer contract or take career inspiration from a gym poster. In this Q&A, he describes what it was like merging a team-first organization like Appirio into a customer-first organization like Wipro, how managing talent is more like soccer than basketball, and why he believes a different mindset is required to drive faster innovation.
Before we dive into the Appirio acquisition story, can you give the readers a little background on your before and after (Wipro) story?
I've had a few different phases in my career. Early on it was about building software solutions for engineering and manufacturing applications. Then it was focused on driving go-to-market, sales, and managing large P&Ls in IT services for consumer/retail industries & enterprise clients. The last few years have been about driving cloud and digital solutions across all industries globally.
I spent 14 years with Wipro, ultimately transforming a $3B global portfolio of applications and cloud services. At its peak, the groups I led employed about 29,000 people. During that time frame, Wipro made a bold bet with a venture fund where I got to really understand the startup ecosystem. We invested in about 10-15 startups in 3 years, and seeing the pace of innovation and agility at these smaller companies was fascinating.
Since leaving Wipro, I've been part of a mid-size company Sunera, and more recently have been advising a couple of startups and venture funds, including Tercera and Propellant. I am also helping shape the digital and cloud strategy at a company called Valqari that is revolutionizing drone delivery for the medical value chain, eCommerce, and last-mile logistics. That about catches you up!
Let's talk about the Appirio acquisition. How did that come to pass?
In my last stint at Wipro, I had a fairly broad portfolio but I simplified it down into what I call the three C’s: Customer experience, cloud, and cybersecurity. These were the parts of the business that were growing faster, and disrupting some of our existing traditional managed services.
Our alignment was strong because the acquisition only took about two and a half months, at the time the largest and fastest in Wipro's history.
At the time, the Salesforce market was growing significantly and Wipro was behind in a sense in the CX space, so we were actively on the lookout for M&A targets. Appirio aligned with two of the three C’s - customer experience and the cloud. We knew Appirio could help differentiate us as we were plotting to expand beyond traditional IT services and accelerate our digital business.
Our alignment was strong because the acquisition only took about two and a half months, at the time the largest and fastest in Wipro's history. Appirio obviously had the capabilities and experience to make it successful, but we also had great chemistry.
Appirio was a strategic bet for Wipro. As the champion of this bet, how did you navigate the journey with internal stakeholders?
One of the business drivers for the Appirio acquisition was to move beyond the CIO, beyond IT, and bring Appirio's unique cloud and customer experience capabilities to Wipro's largest accounts. We wanted to grow those accounts, but also change the nature of our interactions with them. We were looking to move up the value chain and have some differentiated positioning with the CXOs in those enterprises and large customers.
One of the trickier parts of navigating this journey was recognizing our differences in company culture.
In about two years we moved almost 60% of Appirio’s Salesforce business mix to Wipro's client base. We started seeing larger and more integrated deals within our top 100 to 300 accounts, which helped because it brought more visibility to Appirio while adding value to the account teams - the client partners, account managers, and vertical heads.
One of the trickier parts of navigating this journey was recognizing our differences in company culture. It wasn’t exactly easy finding a balance between the two, but it had to be prioritized to get the job done. We got great support from the now Chairman of Wipro, which clearly helped.
What lessons did you take away from the experience of blending Appirio and Wipro’s cultures?
Morphing cultures is never easy, especially given the different leadership styles, but it helped that we came to the table with similar value systems. Values like integrity and ethics were important to both leadership teams, but Wipro held a customer-first mentality while Appirio skewed toward the employee experience.
Through my experience with Appirio, I learned the importance of prioritizing the employee experience. Team and fun were built into Appirio’s value system and it wasn’t just in theory.
There’s no right answer here and one isn’t better than the other, but this was a distinct difference in culture that we had to work at. I knew it was important to find a middle ground because that preference dictates a certain leadership style embedded in the company's DNA and it shapes how employees interact and make decisions.
Through my experience with Appirio, I learned the importance of prioritizing the employee experience. Team and fun were built into Appirio’s value system and it wasn’t just in theory. Appirio’s people actually lived it. Those values influenced how their leaders ran the business and interacted with customers.
I strongly believe that your attitude determines your direction and that it shouldn’t depend on your role, title, or the position of who you’re working with.
To me, Appirio was ahead of the game. Everyone is now talking about how employee experience drives customer experience. Living it with the Appirio team a few years ago convinced me that's true.
What do you consider to be the traits of a great lieutenant?
I think there are some traits that all great leaders share and one of them is attitude. I strongly believe that your attitude determines your direction and that it shouldn’t depend on your role, title, or the position of who you’re working with. Negativity creates a drain and it is important to have a positive mindset even through challenges.
Great leaders and lieutenants are also forward-thinking and data-driven. You have to be two steps ahead to create real momentum, cut through ambiguity, and execute a strategy. Aligning a vision with executional rigor is what makes things happen.
How do you describe your personal leadership style?
I saw this quote in a gym nearly two decades ago: “Take the initiative, lead by example, and applaud the spirit.”
When I read that for the first time it was just another quote. But as I took on different leadership roles, it gradually became part of my personal leadership style.
I saw this quote in a gym nearly two decades ago: “Take the initiative, lead by example, and applaud the spirit.”
Three guiding principles for me that haven't changed for the longest time. One is speed, the second is collaboration, and the third is trust. Whenever I have to make tough decisions or manage a challenging situation, I always go back to those three principles.
I also believe that passion for what you do, always thinking about the customer, and simplifying complexity are critical success factors, and I try to reflect that in my daily interactions.
Do you have any examples of how you put that quote into practice personally?
While I was at Wipro, we were trying to close a large transformational deal with a global retail apparel customer. It was a customer where Wipro didn't have any prior relationships, and for us to secure the $100M deal, their executive sponsor said that I would personally have to dedicate a specific amount of time to ensure the engagement was successful.
I learned so much going deeper under the hood. It was a chance to experience the customer’s reality and get grounded as they transformed their IT landscape.
This put me in a tough spot because, at the time, I was managing a diverse portfolio and big region. But the customer really wanted me to be that hands-on client partner leader to guarantee a successful partnership, so I committed to being named in the contract. It was a big ask at the time, but now I see it as one of the best decisions and experiences of my career. I learned so much going deeper under the hood. It was a chance to experience the customer’s reality and get grounded as they transformed their IT landscape. This experience also validated for me that leading by example motivates your teams to perform better.
Do you have a talent management philosophy?
A mentor of mine from 15 years ago used to say, “You can only be as good as your team, never better.” This has proved to be true of every leadership challenge I’ve taken on. I recently read an interesting book on talent management and culture called “Dreamers and Unicorns.” One of the themes that stuck with me is that talent is not uniformly distributed. I stick to the 80/20 rule for my life in general, but the premise that 20% of the talent drives 80% of the organization's results underscores the importance of building a great team.
In the real world, when it comes to hiring and grooming talent, it's not a basketball game. It's a soccer (or football) game.
In the real world, when it comes to hiring and grooming talent, it's not a basketball game. It's a soccer (or football) game. In a basketball game, you can win with a couple of star players. In soccer, even the weakest links (who are still very good) have to be elevated. It's not just about making your top 20% of the talent stronger. I use Messi, one of the world’s all-time greatest and my son's favorite soccer player, to make this point. For all his greatness he alone hasn’t been able to win a World Cup for Argentina. This is why when I look for talent, I keep an eye for complementing skills to elevate the entire team versus just an individual hero.
The sign of a good leader is to make sure the company’s collective chemistry and results are much bigger than an individual person’s. That said, you also can’t be afraid to make bets on someone. I try to identify those with high potential and unleash what they could bring to the table and many times they are operating at 1-2 levels below. You just have to give them the opportunity and platform to grow. This is what's helped me build great teams and be successful as well.
Having led a $3B portfolio, do you have any tips for other leaders and lieutenants who are trying to scale their companies?
I’ve spent time the last few years engaging with many mid-size and smaller companies in various capacities including partnerships, digital transformation, and investments. I’ve realized that learning goes both ways when it comes to evolving a company. The big guys can afford to learn from smaller to mid-size companies when it comes to innovation speed, while start-ups can learn from large companies how to create business processes that scale.
The big guys can afford to learn from smaller to mid-size companies when it comes to innovation speed, while start-ups can learn from large companies how to create business processes that scale.
For example, start-ups need to put themselves in their customer's shoes, particularly when it comes to larger enterprise clients. During the early stages, growth is based on momentum or cool technology. But to deliver at scale, you have to embed yourself in a customer's specific business process, industry, or problem, and solve that problem through the intersection of various technologies. Tapping into the power of a partner ecosystem is another way to scale faster.
On the flip side, one of the things I've loved about some of the smaller organizations I’ve worked with is that they're not afraid to fail.
On the flip side, one of the things I've loved about some of the smaller organizations I’ve worked with is that they're not afraid to fail. If I were to lead a mid-size or a large organization as a CEO, one of the things I would consciously promote is that it's okay for some initiatives to fail as long as you are learning and getting better. When driving many initiatives to enable faster innovation, agility is a differentiator, and failures create a foundation for continuous and future success.
In a sentence, what do you want your professional legacy to be 20 years from now?
From large enterprises to startups, I helped inspire and shape thousands of careers and added high value to customers. The world has gone through a challenging period in the last 15 months but I’m hopeful about the possibilities post-pandemic and the positive impact we can all make on society.
